Firewall Wizards mailing list archives
RE: Newspaper Article about Cable Modem security
From: Robert Graham <robert_david_graham () yahoo com>
Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 13:58:35 -0800 (PST)
--- "Keller Dennis (DDSP)" <dkeller () ddc dla mil> wrote:
But your average home user does not think about security. Should your local ISP provide a level of security? No (and this will be hotly debated) but they *should* provide information on the risks and solutions.
I find it interesting that the conversation centers around the concept of what the ISP *should* do, as if it has some moral obligation. Usually, such claims of moral obligations run counter to economic practicalities. ISPs charge razor thin margins, and any attempt to be nice to users results in dramatically increased costs. ISPs would like to be nicer to customers, but to do so would require charging customers more, and customers aren't willing to pay more. It's easy to blaim the ISP for being money grubbing capitalists, but the reality is that customers get what they pay for. For example, @Home (and some other ISPs) block incoming port 139 at their routers. Engineers think this is free, because it is trivial configuration in their routers. However, tech support people experience the costs as people call up complaining that they can't share files with their friends. Such filtering also generates bad will from customers who think of this as evil big-brother tactics, and that @Home is really blocking port 139 because they don't want people sharing their MP3 files and sapping the bandwidth. It can easily take 15-minutes with a customer just to figure out the problem is related to port 139. A typical conversation starts out with "Hello, I'm paying $40/month for Internet access from you company but it doesn't work. If I can't get it to work today, I want my money back". Education doesn't work either. Most ISPs already explain about "File and Print Sharing" and security risks. Again, @Home is a good example. They started filtering port 139 because customers wouldn't listen. AOL is another example, they hit customers over the head with message such as "never reveal your password" or "never run a program someone e-mails to you", but customers do it anyway. I talked with one AOL customer that explained why he ran a program that appeared to come from AOL-support via an e-mail, even though he had been told that AOL-support would never send him a program via e-mail (standard soc-eng attack). I think engineers have really no comprehension how ignorant users are. We are all such experts now, and we forget how we were when first exposed to computers (i.e. when the power switch itself is a struggle). Remember that half the Internet users are still at that stage. Moreover, we like computers for their own sake, whereas most users are interested in other things, and only use computers as a tool (i.e. have no interest in learning what the security dangers are). It's easy to criticize the ISPs for not caring, but spending a few weeks answer support calls should cure you of that notion. ===== Robert Graham "Anxiously awaiting the millenium so I can start programming dates with 2-digits again." __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com
Current thread:
- Re: Newspaper Article about Cable Modem security, (continued)
- Re: Newspaper Article about Cable Modem security Michael Cassidy (Nov 02)
- Re: Newspaper Article about Cable Modem security Rodney van den Oever (Nov 01)
- RE: Newspaper Article about Cable Modem security Keller Dennis (DDSP) (Nov 01)
- Re: Newspaper Article about Cable Modem security Joseph S D Yao (Nov 01)
- RE: Newspaper Article about Cable Modem security Michael Cassidy (Nov 02)
- Re: Newspaper Article about Cable Modem security Steven Osman (Nov 01)
- Re: Newspaper Article about Cable Modem security Wozz (Nov 01)
- Re: Newspaper Article about Cable Modem security REID FOX (Nov 01)
- Re: Newspaper Article about Cable Modem security Joseph S D Yao (Nov 02)
- Re: Newspaper Article about Cable Modem security Robert Graham (Nov 01)
- RE: Newspaper Article about Cable Modem security Robert Graham (Nov 01)
- RE: Newspaper Article about Cable Modem security Russ (Nov 02)
- Re: Newspaper Article about Cable Modem security Saso (Nov 05)
- Re: Newspaper Article about Cable Modem security Steven Osman (Nov 08)
- Re: Newspaper Article about Cable Modem security Holger Heimann (Nov 09)
- Re: Newspaper Article about Cable Modem security Saso (Nov 05)
- RE: Newspaper Article about Cable Modem security David Lang (Nov 05)
- RE: Newspaper Article about Cable Modem security sean . kelly (Nov 02)
- RE: Newspaper Article about Cable Modem security sean . kelly (Nov 02)
- RE: Newspaper Article about Cable Modem security Kevin Johnston (Nov 05)
- RE: Newspaper Article about Cable Modem security R. DuFresne (Nov 06)
- RE: Newspaper Article about Cable Modem security dreamwvr (Nov 06)
